314 replies to this topic

[Not Twenty Forever]

Envy On The Coast, on 13 February 2012 - 07:51 PM, said:

Oh, and I think phil dowd handled things absolutely perfectly.  He has really gained a lot of respect in my eyes after his performance

Here here.

[seaders]

Piksi, on 13 February 2012 - 09:41 AM, said:

Fucking hell.

All i said was Evra dropped his hand. How is this unbelievable? What am I missing from your argument? Kenny said earlier in the week that Suarez would shake his hand, you can assume they spoke about it and Kenny said it would be best to just get it over and done with and get on with it. Suarez changed his mind for whatever reason, whether it was premeditated or a reaction to Evra lowering his hand we don't know. It's definitely plausible to assume that he saw Evra drop his hand and changed his mind about shaking hands. Why am I delusional for saying that? What a crock of shit mate, standard United supporter just calling Liverpool fans biased, delusional, idiots, paranoid, conspiracists. Just sick of it.

this is my last post referring to any of this idiocy, but you have watched my video from above,
http://www.tiki-taka...post__p__614532

specifically the view from above, which shows Evra doing *the exact same motion for every handshake*, yeah?  it is absolutely and utterly stunning what some Liverpool fans have made up in their heads about this incident.  there is literally nothing of substance that shows Evra dropping his hand or refusing to shake Suarez's hand, nor Evra pettily ignoring Suarez, but there is clear, and obvious evidence, along with a full admittance that Suarez did refuse to shake Evra's hand, while also ignoring him.  in that video, you see Evra staring straight at Suarez and when he realises Suarez is gonna skip him, he tries to force the handshake.

but no.  Evra dropped his hand minutely and that's what caused the whole situation...

it really is incredulous.

[Piksi]

You are fucking obtuse LOL. That video does nothing but prove my point. Go to 1:01 and look at Evra drop his hand. IT'S RIGHT THERE ON VIDEO. He shakes Henderson's hand then drops it just before Suarez comes. Evra shakes the three players hands before Suarez, his hand dips then returns back up to the normal height. When Suarez comes he dips his hand even lower. I don't mind people insulting others if they are in the right but you're just being a prick for no reason and half your argument is "HURR DUMB LIVERPOO FANS SO STUPID DELUSIONAL IDIOTS AND LIVING IN THEIR FANTASY WORLD!!11". You're an admin of this site and you're going around calling people delusional and effectively calling them morons, nice standard you're setting here.

This pic shows it perfectly, unless it's just another case of deluded and retarded Liverpool fans?

[Lukemeister]

[Hotel California]

I was the one that initially posted the "Evra dropping his hand stuff" but the angle that seaders posted is pretty clear. Evra's hand is there, albeit reluctantly, and Suarez completely ignores him. You can't really debate it.

Those pictures you have posted is once Suarez has passed Evra, and his hand drops.

[Piksi]

Suarez is pretty much in the same position as Henderson when they go to shake hands. If anything Henderson and Enrique are further away from Suarez and look where Evra's hand is. Why would Evra drop his hand after Suarez passes him when Evra's next move is to grab Suarez's arm? Just look at the video over and over from :58 to 1:01, Evra raises his hand to both Enrique and Henderson then leaves it low for Suarez.

Why am I delusional when I can see it right here?

Edited by Piksi, 14 February 2012 - 10:46 AM.

[Lukemeister]

It still looks like Evra drops his hand whether it was intentional or not, yeah would have saved a lot of Shit if Suarez had shook it when Evra basically grabbed his arm but it still would have made Evra appear more dominant have a better presence then Suarez.

Way i see it Suarez went to shake his hand Evra lowered it whether it be intentional or not only  Evra himself knows that, Suarez picked up on the subtle trick by Evra to make him (Evra) appear dominant over him, so refused which fair enough when you go to shake someones hand you should do it as Equals unless your a Boss shaking a potential Employers hand or something along those lines, Suarez blanks him, then Evra lunges for Suarez hand but Suarez still blanks him which he probably shouldnt have done but heyho then Evra makes an ovveracted gesture to the camera about it which he didnt need to do because everyone saw anyway and thats how it all kicked off.

Also it is of my opinion that after the game Evra showed little maturity/sportsmanship by celebrating the way he did, he knew full well it would wind up Liverpool players and fans.

[Travis Bickle]

Ladotelli, on 13 February 2012 - 08:02 PM, said:

Besides, didn't everybody nearly die in a fit of moral outrage when Blatter suggested racism be settled with a handshake ?

This is the most glaring case of hypocrisy in the whole saga. That vile human being, Gordon Taylor, has been the worst for it in my opinion.

[Lukemeister]

I've come to this conclusion:

NEITHER Suarez or Evra are innocent in this whole situation

Suarez and Kenny both apologised because Suarez has been portrayed as the villain in all of this from the Racism shit before, Evra and SAF would have aplogised i imagine if it had been Evra racist to Suarez earlier in the season, its just better to apologise and put an end to situations ASAP, public image and all that.

There's been too much Media Hype/its going too far, read in papaer at work this morning that Kenny, his wife and daughter and Suarez have been receiving Abusive messages/Death threats over twitter, that is fucking low no matter if he was in the wrong or not.

Also read something about a mascot refusing to shake another mascots hand at the villa game, the only thing thats caused all that is all the media hype about it.

Edited by Lukemeister, 14 February 2012 - 11:29 AM.

[Piksi]

Ladotelli, on 13 February 2012 - 08:02 PM, said:

They don't have to shake hands if they don't like eachother, the first incident was blown out of proportion as it is but this whole 'handshakegate' takes the biscuit. Besides, didn't everybody nearly die in a fit of moral outrage when Blatter suggested racism be settled with a handshake ?

Missed this post but it's a fantastic point. People are just trying to distance themselves from racism in whatever way possible and are completely contradicting themselves along the way. This is all such a farce that it's almost comical. It's something that belongs on Days of our Lives.

[Travis Bickle]

Piksi, on 14 February 2012 - 11:33 AM, said:

Missed this post but it's a fantastic point. People are just trying to distance themselves from racism in whatever way possible and are completely contradicting themselves along the way. This is all such a farce that it's almost comical. It's something that belongs on Days of our Lives.

"How fucking dare he suggest racism can be solved with a handshake! Now lets charge that Suarez bastard to prove a point! How about we now cry our eyes out when he doesn't shake his hand? Because we all know that would solve the issue!"

Fucking wankers, the lot of them.

[II Capitano]

Firstly, look at the slow-motion clip of the handshake. As you can clearly see, Suarez pulls off a slick move, he completely ignores Evra, seconds after looking at his hand. Now, fair enough, it might have been too low down for his poor hand to reach, but he made no attempt to shake it (his hand). Just study the slow-motion clip again and you will see, there's no denying that from that position - Suarez ignores Evra. Piksi, those pictures you posted are highly misleading, another reason why you should closely examine the video umpteen times before making your conclusion. Now fast forward to 58 seconds. Evra shakes the hand of Spearing and then lowers it down; Evra shakes Enrique's hand and lowers it down; and finally shakes Henderson's hand and lowers it down. There's a clear vivid pattern. Why does Evra hold onto Suarez's hand once he ignores him? obviously because he wants to shake his hand. Suarez had an agreement with the club, one that he failed to meet. But now, people are desperately trying to prove he's all innocent...

[Piksi]

Omfg this is extremely tedious. I acknowledged both were in the wrong. I said Suarez should've reached for it but in his mind he probably thought Evra was trolling him even further and changed his mind. I acknowledged that Evra's hand dips low then he raises it again. It's also clear for anyone to see that Evra's hand does not return to the previous position and height that it was at when he shook the hands of the three players before. If Evra was so shocked that Suarez didn't shake his hand then he wouldn't have immediately pointed to the camera to try and show this atrocity.

[Not Twenty Forever]

How epic is the next handsake going to be.. I wonder what odds I'd get on Evra leaving him hanging..

[Bill Nicholson]

Seriously, this entire argument is boring as fuck. It has essentially come down to Man Utd fans defending Evra and condemning Suarez, and Liverpool fans defending Suarez and condemning Evra. It's never going to be settled. The only way that we can move on from this is to come to an agreement, so how about we agree to disagree and let bygones be bygones? No one wants to constantly read about this, especially when there will be no solution and it could very well last a long time. Just move on, lads. None of us have personally been the subject of racism here, or indeed falsely accused of racism. Don't take it so personally.

This game was played three days ago, yet it's still rife with conversation. Not about the game, but about Evra and Suarez. With that in mind, I'm going to close this thread. The game is over -- well done, Man Utd fans, and commiserations to the Liverpool fans  -- so let's move on and concentrate on the upcoming games, in the Europa League and F.A. Cup.